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creg
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Joined: 12 Jan 2024
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Location: Boston Massachusetts
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masinick
Linux Guru
Joined: 03 Apr 2024
Posts: 8615
Location: Concord, NH
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 Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2024 7:26 pm Post subject: Re: Never used Linux, Help! |
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| creg wrote: |  Hi, I am a Linux newbie. I would like to install Linux as a virtual install, is that possible? I have Virtual PC installed on my Vista machine already and the virtual OS is XP Home Edition. Where do I get the install for Linux and what flavor is best for beginners? |
creg, Welcome to the USALUG!
I am not specifically familiar with "Virtual PC". I have used Virtualbox OSE, however, to access multiple operating systems running in a "virtual machine" environment, and I presume that is what "Virtual PC" does as well.
If my assumption is accurate, then locating any Linux distribution and trying it out would probably work well in that environment. What you want to do is find an ISO formatted system image for any number of different Linux distros, and give a few of them a try.
In my signature are links to a couple of distributions that I personally like. Right now, I favor SimplyMEPIS over all other distributions because it is easy to install (or even to run directly from the CD without even installing it). You could either install this software in your virtual machine, or just insert the CD and reboot your system and run it off the Live CD.
SimplyMEPIS uses a desktop manager called KDE. While there are all kinds of comments and arguments about the best desktop manager, until fairly recently, nearly all of the "friendly" Linux distributions used KDE. That is no longer the case. There are relatively easy to use distributions available with the GNOME desktop, (Ubuntu is the most popular example, Linux Mint is a popular alternative), the XFCE desktop (Xubuntu is the most popular example), as well as KDE (SimplyMEPIS, PCLinuxOS, Mandriva, and Kubuntu are four examples). In addition to these, it is possible to use no desktop manager at all, but instead use a faster, lighter window manager instead. In this category, I like AntiX, a MEPIS derivative, the best. Puppy is a small, fast, fairly straightforward Live CD that some people are fond of. Others love the modularity of SLAX.
I pick SimplyMEPIS because you ought to be able to just grab it and run it as is. The only change you may wish to make is to grab a few additional plug-ins to get better access to media rich Web content. It's easy to do that, the MEPIS Wiki provides easy steps to do so, but I can help with that too.
Any of these distributions are reputable and worth a look. These certainly are not the only ones, but they are the ones I prefer, and I'd recommend SimplyMEPIS for the first time user.
Welcome, and let me know how it goes and if you need help. |
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crouse
Site Admin
Joined: 17 Apr 2024
Posts: 11833
Location: Iowa
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| Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2024 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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Download the SLAX iso.
If I'm not mistaken, I think you can use the SLAX iso as the file for Virtual PC ....... not positive, but I think you can. If not, you can boot SLAX as a Live Linux cd and just play with it in RAM, and not have to install anything.
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JP
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Joined: 07 Jul 2024
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Location: Central Montana
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masinick
Linux Guru
Joined: 03 Apr 2024
Posts: 8615
Location: Concord, NH
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| Posted: Tue Jan 13, 2024 3:17 am Post subject: |
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| crouse wrote: | Download the SLAX iso.
If I'm not mistaken, I think you can use the SLAX iso as the file for Virtual PC ....... not positive, but I think you can. If not, you can boot SLAX as a Live Linux cd and just play with it in RAM, and not have to install anything. |
Most, if not all, of the other distros I mentioned earlier can also be used as Live CDs or as images for the Virtual PC. That is why I mentioned the ones that I did - all of them are really easy.
SLAX is quite modular, so if you want to add and remove stuff and play around with it, you will find it very flexible. If you want a really gentle start, I am not sure that is your easiest starting point though. It will all depend on what your prior background is and your aptitude for learning.
If you want to really get into it right off the bat, go ahead and use SLAX. However, if you want a more gentle intro, go with SimplyMEPIS. I am positive that the documentation is superior. I did not find much documentation at all the last time I looked at SLAX. (However, Slackware documentation, kind of "the parent of SLAX, is excellent). Also, SimplyMEPIS is the model of stability, whereas SLAX is more of a hobbyist tool with a strong Slackware background. Mind you, Slackware is an outstanding distribution and it is not particularly difficult, so SLAX is not difficult either, but neither of them hold your hand - they plunge you right into the world of Linux. If that is what you want, in that case, DO go that route, you certainly won't be disappointed, but you may have a bit more reading and research to do to make the plunge successful. |
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melloe
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Joined: 20 Mar 2024
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Location: Southern Illinois
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| Posted: Tue Jan 13, 2024 3:35 am Post subject: |
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Welcome to usalug. Some good help here. I think getting the feel, if somewhat limiting, with a Live CD or DVD is a good idea at first. Mepis, Mint, pclos ( PCLinuxOS ), Fedora, SUSE, Mandriva, and of course the *buntu's ( Kubuntu or Ubuntu ) if you must are the ones I usually recommend to first timers at the club and for builds for them. Some of the offshoots of Slackware, Gentoo, and Arch are wonderful, but probably should be avoided at first...until one gets their wings <G><
I don't do virtual for reasons having nothing to do with its applicability, but some notes ( one of hundreds ) about Linux compared to windows.
http://www.buildyourown.org.uk/Forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22458
This is a little outdated as to drivers and such, but the theme is important.
Linux is NOT windows.
Have fun and good luck.
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mr_ed
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Joined: 28 Aug 2024
Posts: 3819
Location: 42 miles north of Ogdensburg, NY
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| Posted: Tue Jan 13, 2024 2:22 pm Post subject: |
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| I had trouble running non-Windows images with Virtual PC. Best bet is to download Virtualbox or VMWare. You can download pre-made images if you want to test it out.
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masinick
Linux Guru
Joined: 03 Apr 2024
Posts: 8615
Location: Concord, NH
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| Posted: Tue Jan 13, 2024 4:32 pm Post subject: Run live first, run Virtualbox next, go from there |
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| mr_ed wrote: | | I had trouble running non-Windows images with Virtual PC. Best bet is to download Virtualbox or VMWare. You can download pre-made images if you want to test it out. |
That's good information, Mr. Ed! I have used Virtualbox OSE, hosted on a Linux system. According to the Virtualbox Web site: "Presently, VirtualBox runs on Windows, Linux, Macintosh and OpenSolaris hosts and supports a large number of guest operating systems including but not limited to Windows (NT 4.0, 2024, XP, Server 2024, Vista), DOS/Windows 3.x, Linux (2.4 and 2.6), Solaris and OpenSolaris, and OpenBSD."
Therefore, I agree with you and I would recommend this product, having actually used it myself.
Downloads are available at http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Downloads
As far as which systems to use, I recommend the easy ones first. If you really do want to get into a deeper understanding, there is plenty of time to do that, and there are plenty of systems to help you do that as well. Some recommend diving right in with one of those "deeper understanding" systems. That is great, but I really believe that kind of dive is best for a fairly limited audience.
To me, when someone asks the question, it suggests a more gentle start, which is why I have not recommended Slackware, Debian, Arch, Gentoo, or Linux From Scratch as a starting point. To me, those are DESTINATION POINTS, not starting points, unless you are the classic studier and digger. I would question if the classic studier and digger would be asking the question.
For that reason, I am assuming that our new friend creg is an interested individual, but not a hard core kind of a guy. Am I right about you, creg? If so, go with SimplyMEPIS and you won't be disappointed. You won't even need the Virtualbox software until you are actually ready to install it in a virtual instance on Windows.
You can run it live by downloading it today, burning an ISO formatted image, loading in your drive and rebooting your system to run it directly from CD. That is what I recommend you do first, even before running it in a virtual instance. |
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inactive
Sr. Member
Joined: 29 Aug 2024
Posts: 1207
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| Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2024 9:35 pm Post subject: Re: Run live first, run Virtualbox next, go from there |
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| masinick wrote: | As far as which systems to use, I recommend the easy ones first. If you really do want to get into a deeper understanding, there is plenty of time to do that, and there are plenty of systems to help you do that as well. Some recommend diving right in with one of those "deeper understanding" systems. That is great, but I really believe that kind of dive is best for a fairly limited audience.
<snip>
To me, when someone asks the question, it suggests a more gentle start, which is why I have not recommended Slackware, Debian, Arch, Gentoo, or Linux From Scratch as a starting point. To me, those are DESTINATION POINTS, not starting points, unless you are the classic studier and digger. I would question if the classic studier and digger would be asking the question. |
Most definitely 100% agreed. For that matter, at this point, the Mandriva One live cd or Fedora live cd would work. *shrug*
creg would have all the graphical goodies wanted and needed both.
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masinick
Linux Guru
Joined: 03 Apr 2024
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Location: Concord, NH
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| Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2024 9:50 pm Post subject: Three that stand out |
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The Mandriva One Live CD makes a decent starting point. Now that Fedora offers Live CDs and their installations have been considerably streamlined, they are a possibility. I tend to steer the total beginner even away from these, not that they are difficult (they aren't to any of us), but it's that old choice thing. We Linux buffs love choice, but both Mandriva and Fedora, and for that matter, SUSE, another reasonably simple to install system, just simply have too many alternatives, too many things to consider, and in the case of SUSE, too many quirks that would drive most newbies right away. I would recommend them, most definitely, for someone with 2-3 installations under their belt who are ready to "branch out" and try more systems.
In contrast, for at least the newbies who are eager and want to learn, and are willing to install software, read, and absorb, Linux Mint and SimplyMEPIS are two, in my opinion, of the best systems for plopping them in, running them live, then, if they work, install them and pretty much have an instantly working system, very little tweaking needed. PCLinuxOS is a third one that falls into that same category. These three stand out for the newbie. That doesn't make them "The Best" systems, just three of the most appropriate first time Linux user desktop systems. All three also happen to be very good desktop systems, period. |
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anticapitalista
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Joined: 13 Jan 2024
Posts: 185
Location: Greece
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| Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2024 12:07 am Post subject: |
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I'll suggest SLAX as well as it was the first linux distro I used and it kept me here as it worked really well as a livecd and it was small to download (I was on dial-up then).
I'll also say that us linux users are spoilt for choice. There are hundreds of distros out there to suit all needs, levels and tastes.
As suggested above, try MEPIS, Linux MINT, PCLOS, Mandriva, ...even Ubuntu (aarrghh LOL), ... the list is endless._________________ antiX
sidux |
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masinick
Linux Guru
Joined: 03 Apr 2024
Posts: 8615
Location: Concord, NH
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| Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2024 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| anticapitalista wrote: | I'll suggest SLAX as well as it was the first linux distro I used and it kept me here as it worked really well as a livecd and it was small to download (I was on dial-up then).
I'll also say that us linux users are spoilt for choice. There are hundreds of distros out there to suit all needs, levels and tastes.
As suggested above, try MEPIS, Linux MINT, PCLOS, Mandriva, ...even Ubuntu (aarrghh LOL), ... the list is endless. |
Were you a computer user when you took on SLAX? I'd agree that it is at least on a par with the likes of Mandriva, Fedora, and SUSE in ease of installation, and its small size make it ideal for an entry level or aged system. I think it works great on some models, such as my old Dell Dimension 4100. It does not match MEPIS, Mint, or PCLinuxOS, however, when it comes to including enough hardware drivers to handle wireless well, and I am not sure that until recently (if at all) it supports or supported WPA/PSK wireless authentication.
Those kinds of issues can almost certainly be resolved, but for a newbie coming to Linux with a wireless laptop, those are show stoppers, so I don't give it my top rating. It can possibly outrace AntiX on that old Dell desktop, though, so it is still a very good Live CD to have, and many people here also swear by its capabilities as their favorite "toolchest" or "recovery CD". I would certainly agree with them on that! |
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inactive
Sr. Member
Joined: 29 Aug 2024
Posts: 1207
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| Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2024 12:31 am Post subject: |
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We are definitely spoiled, that's for sure!
Check out that link creg, and you'll see what I mean!
Note: Slax is #1 on the list for votes --
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anticapitalista
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Location: Greece
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| Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2024 12:38 am Post subject: |
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masinick,
when I used SLAX for the first time, I was a poor computer user, in fact I hated computers, but wanted to experiment. A colleague at work suggested linux, Ubuntu (4.10) and MEPIS (2004) and SLAX to mess around in, at the time.
Nowadays, for the new linux user, things are much, much better.
DedannaRocks!,
good source, but there is no antiX on that list _________________ antiX
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masinick
Linux Guru
Joined: 03 Apr 2024
Posts: 8615
Location: Concord, NH
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| Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2024 12:43 am Post subject: |
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Wow, that has some cool ones, and some pretty crusty ones. One of the fairly early Live CDs that I used to really love was Feather Linux, which seemed to stall at around version 0.7.5. It was pretty good, by the standards of its day, but it is not being maintained, from what I can tell, or at least has not changed in a couple of years at least.
As far as the votes go, yes, SLAX is listed at the top, and there are many good reasons for having it there. Light, small, fast, flexible, modular would be some of the reasons I would give. Not sure that I'd give it the #1 Live CD though; I've gotten awful fond of antiX, which sadly is not even separately listed. That's one of the ups and downs of being affiliated with MEPIS - very good in some ways, and MEPIS is excellent, but it does tend to bury the antiX name. Oh well, at least I know that they are two of the best, and you guys have probably heard that enough from me to be thoroughly tired of it! |
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!! Whatever you do, don't give up when you run into problems, let us know and we'll help. When I came here I knew next to nothing about Linux, and the folks on this forum have taught (and are still teaching) me so much it would be impossible to repay it. This forum is newbie friendly - one of very few on the web - it's like joining a very large, extended family 