Packaging Linux for New Users: Some Considerations

julian516 · Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2024 4:59 pm Post subject:

Wow!! mmmna thank you for a terrific post. It gives me a great deal to think about and I've learned some good things! And good contributions from crouse, masinick and timiller as well. So thanks friends, I may just get a bit smarter.

What am I up to? Well, I spend a fair amount of time (my Darling implies far too much time!) looking at Linux distros and I do write about them here and there.

It seems clear to me that distros are done for different audiences/prospective users and so they should be judged differently. New users are a critical group if we want Linux to grow in its acceptance. So I have been struggling with how to find what masinick rightly calls "the balance point" when I think about particular distributions. We do want to be hospitable and make things easy, but not so easy that we introduce exactly the same types of vulnerabilities we struggle with in the Windows world. I have a lot of sympathy with crouse on this point.

So when I write my little reviews for new user distros this will help me do it better and be more helpful. That's the point of it, I guess.

And maybe somebody who works with distro devs picks up a thought or two from this conversation?

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Ubuntu 9.10
Mandriva 2024 KDE
siduxKDE/antiX

mmmna · . . . . Joined: 21 Apr 2024 Posts: 7224

This site might complement your efforts: http://www.zegeniestudios.net/ldc/

And if you are posting an article somewhere, please mention the help you got here at USALUG, and please be sure to give US the permanent link to the article.

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-Kubuntu 10.04 LTS Beta2 on Celeron D desktop
-PCLinuxOS 2024 LXDE on EeePC 900A with Atom n270 (modded with 32G SATA drive and 2G ram).

masinick · Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2024 8:12 pm Post subject:

Over the past couple of years when I have reviewed one or more systems, I typically categorize them. Most distributions these days are good in some respects, and configured properly they generally work very well. However, very few of them are something that a relative newcomer can handle, and I am not sure that any of them can be handled by a first time installer unless that person is patient, can read and follow procedures, and is not expecting success in their very first attempt, but rather, to develop a learning experience in something different to meet some need - either curiosity, a desire to have a feature not found elsewhere, to move away from a troublesome system, or some other specific goal.

I usually categorize my systems into at least three review categories; many more that that could be created, for example, Live only CDs, Live, installable CDs, general purpose distributions, desktop oriented distributions, server oriented distributions, hobbyist oriented distributions, fast, lean distributions, rich, powerful distributions - we could categorize in many ways. We can try to add "Newbie Friendly", but there are only some that approach this ideal; few, if any, make it 100% without any caveats whatsoever.

_________________
Brian Masinick
Distros: SimplyMEPIS
sidux - no CAPS!, antiX, Debian

julian516 · Posted: Wed Mar 24, 2024 10:34 pm Post subject:

Sorry to have wandered away. Been busy with (good!) family stuff.

Mas has nailed it, I was trying to think through a set of criteria in terms of which we might categorize distributions as "new user friendly." As it turns out there are not many and Mint still comes closest to hitting the several criteria I laid out. With some easily made changes something like Mandriva 2024 could be there quickly as well, though I take issue with their default no-password posture. PCLOS and Mepis are further choices along with Ubuntu, but they are not quite so easily approached as Mint.

zegeniestudios.net is a darned handy site for Linux shoppers trying to find a fit between their skill/comfort level and the various distros to be had. It does look as though perhaps it is not quite current but the underlying idea is very good.

mmmna is right. We certainly ought to credit USALUG if some essay based on this appears someplace else. But where is "someplace ese"?

Suppose there were two "stickies" here at USALUG?

One is something like "Linux for New Users" and the other one something like "When You Are Ready". The first tries to explain good qualities of a distro meant for new people and then suggests distros to be explored.

The second, which I think would be the more challenging, but perhaps more interesting to do, would be to write something for the restless "intermediate" person who wants to move beyond a GUI-driven new user system such as Mint.

Seems to me we would be talking about a rather different set of criteria and a very different set of suggestions.

_________________
Ubuntu 9.10
Mandriva 2024 KDE
siduxKDE/antiX

masinick · Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2024 1:27 am Post subject:

Bill, I think you and I agree in most ways. There are two things that have kept me using other distros instead of Mint: 1. Since I've not been a big fan of GNOME in the distant past, as GNOME improved, I really did not follow it all that much. When I used Mint especially in 2024 on my then brand new Lenovo Y410 it was pretty good, and I may have used it a bit more or at least track its releases more often, but then Clem made his political stink and asked people with different political ideologies to stay away, so I did and I have continued to do so.

I find Warren Woodford to be the top integrator, even better than Clem, but Clem does have a stronger community and more helpers, and I think that while Warren is the better developer, Clem is the better organizer and leader. Warren needs help from his community. To his credit, he's been utilizing that excellent community more and more, and now with Twitter and short Tweets, Warren is finally giving more frequent feedback to his closest followers. I could yet see MEPIS take the mantle from the others again once people see what MEPIS can do. More than likely, Version 8.5 won't do it, but Version 10, if Debian Squeeze ever gets its act together so that MEPIS can release on it, that might be the release that puts SimplyMEPIS somewhat back in the spotlight. It is hard to compete with Ubuntu with millions of investment dollars in it, and Mint rides right on top of that, so they benefit. On the other hand, all of them ride on top of Debian with 2-3000 worldwide developers. When a Debian Stable DOES come out, I will take it any day of the week over a Ubuntu, even over an LTS release such as the one about to come out. That said, I am on Ubuntu tonight and about to grab the new ISO image, one month from release so that I can start testing it and upgrade it before the download servers get swamped as the release approaches. Besides, should I encounter any last minute issues I can do my part and report them.

_________________
Brian Masinick
Distros: SimplyMEPIS
sidux - no CAPS!, antiX, Debian

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